Friday, December 28, 2007

Commenting on deleted Corry Pub post

Shit, I was just doing a Google to locate my blog on an alternate computer and came across this post, which really takes me to task.

(Here's my comment, which I attempted to post on the linked to site, but for some reason I wasn't allowed to because comments on that blog are restricted to team members. Seems like an ironic policy for a blog that is basically ripping on me for deleting a comment I never even saw, but hey, it's a free world)
Sorry - I never saw the comment that the anonymous person has posted here. My colleague at the blog, Dr.D - a former Corry employee like myself made the original post. I think basically what he posted is accurate - or at least moreso than the story Corry tells, but hell, everybody lies a little... (and Brutus is an honorable man.)
Anyways, after Dr.D posted it, we both decided that it might appear a bit unprofessional, so we made a decision to take it down.
I guess it's back up now- as I'm including this link that has the original post plus the comments. Please feel free to comment, but I don't really appreciate snide, behind the back, peronal attacks. I really had no idea that anyone had even read this post and honsetly never saw the comment.
I am all about encouraging open, honest discussion.
Cheers.
Ralph

13 comments:

stan langerhaus said...

R, I would not take the EBW comments too personally. It seems from the amount of ad hominen (sp?)vitriol in the EBW blog stems from not getting what he/she wanted for Xmas more than anything you did.

From my experience, Ralph's Place is one of the only sites in Erie that is not monitored or filtered by some jackass who only wants to propound his/her thoughts and vision and will only post those who agree. Whether the blogger is anon, psuedo, real or imaginery. So, I say damn the torpedos and keep on truckin' (how's that for a mixed metaphor/cliche?).

Erie Blogwatch said...

Please allow me to respond to your remarks about Erie BlogWatch ( http://erie-blog-watch.blogspot.com ).

First, the text of your original article was submitted in-line by an EBW commenter. Second, I wrote at the time ---

"EDITOR'S NOTE -- I thought long and hard before approving the message above which quoted an entire post verbatim from another blog.

It is one thing to excerpt relevant portions from another source for reference in your comments here. I would consider that to be a straightforward case of "fair use" in principle.

However, I was not so sure that was the case in this instance.

I checked Ralph's Place blog to see if there was any applicable copyright declaration, but I could not find one. I also could not find any sort of statement of retraction for this particular piece of content (if there had been one, I would've honored it and not allowed the 'reprint' here). Finally, I remembered reading the original post a couple of days ago while it was available from Ralph's Place so I am comfortable that Anonymous' submission is a reasonable facsimile or more likely an exact --if now unverifiable-- copy. It would be all too easy for an adversary to "put words into someone's mouth" this way through a false attribution but I don't think that is the case.

So you can read it here, but be advised that I will continue to closely scrutinize this sort of situation in the future and make any moderation decisions on a case-by-case basis.

With liberty comes responsibility."


These statements currently remain on EBW in our archives as can be seen at the link you provided.

Further study shows that well over 24 hours had elapsed between publication on Ralph's Place, and any subsequent reuse. That should address any concerns that we "rushed to judgement" or failed to allow adequate time for you to make a formal statement of retraction if that was your intent.

Although comments have subsequently been disabled due to the ongoing dissonance generated primarily by the commenter who was responsible for submitting your content for republication, I have always been receptive to private email received at our widely-known email address:

erieblogwatch@gmail.com

Guset posts are always welcome. Unfortunately, it became necessary to introduce this form of hysteresis into the system in order to excise the hysteria.

Anyhow, if you now wish to have your content removed from EBW, then I will do so without grudge or prejudice. Just let me know. I mean what I say. That entire thread shall be expunged from our website. However be aware that Google will likely retain a cached copy.

Meanwhile, I wish you a Happy New Year and success in publishing your blog which Stan Langerhaus touts as "one of the only sites in Erie that is not monitored or filtered by some jackass who only wants to propound his/her thoughts and vision and will only post those who agree."

That is quite an admirable goal. If you review the history of EBW, that is also what we were trying to achieve. However, the actions of one or two easily-identifiable deranged individuals resulted in a rhetorical "tragedy of the commons" which was no longer viable. This same phenomenon has and continues to manifest itself on other Erie-related blogs as well.

Finally, it is interesting that Stan is apparently so offended by the "ad hominem vitriol" he perceives to exist in EBW but fails to condemn the original diatribe about Corry Publishing which appeared here. In fact, it seems like he inadvertently salutes it.

Anonymous said...

Heavy D has disconnected from Erie Blog Watch.

Emgr Jack Tirak has torn down the link to Erie Blog Watch.

Global Erie remains your only source to link Erie Blog Watch, unless EBW comments somewhere and you tap into the name. Oh yes, Google gets em too.

From standing room only, it took the blogger less than 3 months to go into death throbs.

Read the opening WELCOME at EBW and the intent is clear. This bastion of anonymity will allow comments there, that have been denied elsewhere.

And the commenters poured in.
EBW moaned about the kevetch sisters and low quality of Erie Bloggers.

Then EBW went bi-polar.
I love you Dennis;
please mea culpa and don't throw me in jail Dennis.

"Folks, I can't make this stuff up and the quality of ideas and civility is great! I have not seen it in months of alcoholic neighbors
and chasing through months of kevetchings----close enough?"
Let see, tomorrow is Sunday, so that means be critical of Erie Bloggie Dennis. But, Dennis will go legal (or so he vents). Must be nice to dennis on Sunday.Oh, oh, oh,....what's a mouse to do?

Commenter dissonance is desirable and a function of blogger operations like deleting comments. THAT is what responsible Erie Bloggers have done, except for EBW. He speaks of being "gaslighted" by a comment and proceeds in total disarray.
Shitcan that stuff.

You ask for email to you. The emailer is now known; YOU remain anon. Don't expect a lot of mail.

You ask for guest posts at EBW. Bloggers guest post to draw an audience and an awareness of their blog. Hopefully, links too.

People are DIS-linking to EBW; not a great calling card.
No comments due to your inabilities to moderate? Don't expect guest posts to meander into a cone of silence from the audience there Maxwell Smart.

And you have an obsession with knowing WHO is posting. Content, discussion, and idea exchange were thrown out the window in favor of guessing games at who posts anon or otherwise.
"It's this person"
"No! It's that person"
Who cares? You could have cut dissonance by deleting that crap.

You took Full frontal Lucidity to task over Joke LaRocca instead of the proper Joe LaRocca on early days into your blog. You never reached that pinnacle of standard again.

Erie Blogs was never thrilled with your stated intent to review them. It was a continuous grope to see what we could see. It was never a defined reference to quality.

Ralph admits to deleting an entire blog. Unusual to do that, but he stands up and admits he did it. That is why Ralph is lasting years instead of death in 3 months as a blogger.

After alienating every blogger in Erie Blogs (except Panepento apparently), you now alienate any comments as unacceptable (even by Ralph in his own defense---Post his response at your place like an adult would do!).

No bloggers checking in.
No comments allowed.
No guests need show up or they lose their identity and you retain your anon.
No guest posters show up as they seek to enlarge their audience. Guesting at EBW will lose an audience.

You really have no purpose and the only one to blame is in your mirror.

Your claim to fame at EBW was more outing than credibility or credibility redux. You failed at all when you melted down in the end. The average blog lives 3 months. Write yourself 2 or 3 times so the average does not go lower. You have lowered the bar enough EBW.

Jack Tirak said...

I don't know who got the idea that I disconnected Erie Blog Watch. I didn't have it as a link in the first place. I was waiting to further see how updated it would be before I placed a link to it. It is not updated as much as I thought readers would like to justify a link so I didn't create one.

Anonymous said...

Erie Blog Watch was clearly posted in Erie Media Go Round. It was posted with Erie Counter Media (Joe LaRocca's Blog), Outside Erie, Think Big Erie, and the rest.
THAT is the link area at EMGR.

Erie Blog Watch is no longer listed in that spot at all.
There was never a claim that it was disconnected as Tirak writes.

Here is the claim again as Jack missed it:
"Heavy D has disconnected from Erie Blog Watch.

Emgr Jack Tirak has torn down the link to Erie Blog Watch."

Whether the link was ever connected is between Jack and anyone who tried it. I have no clue.
Of one thing I am sure,
Erie Blog Watch was IN that favorited links area and
Erie Blog Watch is NO LONGER IN that favorited area.

The fact that it was considered as a link, and then declined, speaks even more strongly to the point I have made above.

This anonymous blogger has zero credibility.
LaRocca came on board around the same time to be a Media WatchDog, but morphed into an Erie Times infection. A review by anyone of Blogs were ignored. Joe wanted ETN.

Erie Blog Watch had a tremendous opportunity to highlight the new media.
Instead, it got off to a rant with Heart Attack Jack over credibility of Anonymous posts and blogs. The blogger is anonymous to this day.

It became a repository of deleted comments from Erie Bloggers next. While the effort and thought were noble, they take moderating and blogging skills that are beyond the scope and ability of the blog.

EBW notes and agrees that Erie Blogs skipped scrolling EBW and then tried unsuccessfully to rehabilitate. Instead, EBW was honored with a legal notice from Dennis and caved big time.

Read the stated goals of the blog in archives. Day One was less than 3 months ago.

No one can comment there.
If there are any errors or ommissions, tough luck as Ralph just found out. You can not post a correction or an opinion. It is a closed blog and that smacks of censorship.

Nothing wrong with closing shop. Millions of blogs shut down forever every year. EBW just shut down comments and any revelation of EBW identity to you if you email to them....a one way street and not wise in an identity theft world we have. Would YOU send YOUR email to an Anonymous address???

Erie Blogs had a house cleaning and wiped out a significant number of dead blogs including Heart Attack Jack, Inside Erie (Panepento's original series), and Insights by Christie, among others. These blog owners submit posts no more. It would have been preferrable to have them moved to an ARCHIVE area of former Erie Blogs (the history would be maintained).

Erie Blogs also wiped out several blogs that do continue, have a relationship to do with Erie, and are no longer scrolled or sourced below in alphabetical order. They are cleaning house there apparently.

Erie Blog Watch is both extremes. It is no longer listed alphabetically or scrolled at Erie Blogs, has no comments, and apparently posts if you send them a legal email like Dennis did.

A huge opportunity to give open oversight to Blogs, Erie Blogs and all others, and to attempt international standards in blogging or guidelines even, could have happened. EBW went a different direction and the owner killed his goose there.

On the bright side, we have absolutely no brain drain with this outfit leaving.

And Jack Tirak, since you read Ralph, if you are gonna play around with your links (working, nonworking, hooked up or not, the Counter News Media Blog is atrocious to be associated with.
NO ONE reposts last months post again. It is ETN diatribe hatred with emphasis...unethically I might add, and I am not an ETN praiser.

People shop blogs and links. The links are critical. If I told you a great place to eat and you vomited every bite, you would recall the restaurant forever AND who sent you there too. You would return to neither.
It works that way in blog world too.

Anonymous said...

Thank you all for the sleep-inducing, seemingly-unending posts laden with minutia and inventive spelling.

I guess I won't need a Valium tonight!

Anonymous said...

Corry Pub HMO covers the Valium.
But soporific words work best for you. Saving your health care costs is our mission. You are welcome. Sleep well and prosper.

DrD said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Ralph said...

Alright, that was pretty entertaining...although a bit disjointed at times. (Dr. D, I was apparently writing this comment at the same time you were)

First off, despite his focus on the ETN, I'm still going to stick by my support of Joe LaRocca who is a good writer and puts some thought into his posts.

As for EBW, seems like a good idea, although maybe a few years ahead of its time. I think it's quite fair for Joe to take to task the ETN, because it's a professional endeavor and thus I view it as fair game. Most Erie blogs are done as a public service or just for kicks - I don't think anybody is making any money - so to hold them to the same standard as the ETN seems a bit unfair.

As for Dennis Weed's Erie Blogs, I give him tremendous credit for posting every day and setting up some good links, but the content is getting rather dull. But once again, I assume he is doing this mainly as a non-profit public service, so let's cut him a bit of slack.

Maybe I'm naieve, but those are my thoughts.

Anyhow, happy New Year to everyone, and I personally enjoy blogging, which is the main reason why I do it, and I appreciate anyone who takes the time to post a comment on my site.

Cheers.

Ralph

Addendum: DrDee, this kind of refers to my last point, I guess I can understand why someone would feel slighted after they put a lot of time into writing a comment only to have it deleted. Anyhow, I hope everyone has some sense of satisfaction now - although I guess the Corry Pub people might still have their say.

X

Jack Tirak said...

To repeat, EMGR never had a link to Erie Blog Watch. We did have a link to Joe's site and changed the name when Joe changed the name of his site.

Joe's site was originally called Erie News Watch. Perhaps that's were the confusion lies. I personally don't have a problem with Erie Blog Watch. I just wish it was more updated.

Anonymous said...

I agree with Stan about the vitriol from commenters on EBW. That's what brought their site down - it had the potential for serious dialogue and community building, but turned into a hate-fest. Too bad.

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